For that one guy… I think he goes by Ghost Salmon
Recently I read a pathetic piece of tripe. It was another one of those unlearned eisegetical blubbering’s concerning “free will”. As usual the author simply began with his own inclinations rather than the scriptures in order to solidify a belief he already held without any earnest or truthful searching. Instead the individual merely plucked two commonly misunderstood verses out from their rightful context in order to proof text himself into felling the old warm and fuzzies of his Sunday school days.
Though one can easily find a proper undertaking of these verses found in 1 Tim. 2:4 and 2 Peter 3:9 in any good commentary series, it seems that taking a few moments out of his time to actually investigate his beliefs was a bit to arduous a task for my dear friend. So let us take a short moment to examine the first of these texts (though not exhaustively due to our present space as well as all of our dwindling attention spans for what should otherwise be the duty of our friend instead of our own).
The verse is 1 Tim. 2:4 which reads, “Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.” I
ndeed the limitations of this verse should be at this point quite clear. This verse as all verses means little to nothing without its ever important context. Therefore here is the verse as it appears in a complete thought: “I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, [and] giving of thanks, be made for all men; For kings, and [for] all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. For this [is] good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.” (1Tim. 1-4)
As it should now be clear, the verse appears amidst a request from Paul to pray for the rulers of the world (more specifically in this case for Nero who is violently opposed to Christianity). The appeal is for a “peaceable life” and so an appeal for both the salvation of the enemies of Christ and also for the “quiet” in the lives of people negatively affected by “kings” so that “peace” can come to fruition as people learn of the Christ and His gospel without the threat of persecution surrounding them and affecting their decisions. As such the context of this verse describes a people who are told that they should not “right off” anyone but should instead pray for “all men” (not knowing as God does who is elect and who is not –something near and dear to the heart of Paul no doubt). What’s more the word “all” itself that has been called into question. Though the word is often used to express a totality this is not always or even most often the case. In fact, “all” is many times used to identify categories or collectives as is sited below from the Strong’s number [3956].
pas = all or all of a particular category
1) individually
a) each, every, any, all, the whole, everyone, all things, everything
2) collectively
a) some of all types “the whole world has gone after him” Did all the world go after Christ? “then went all Judea, and were baptized of him in Jordan.” Was all Judea, or all Jerusalem, baptized in Jordan? “Ye are of God, little children”, and the whole world lieth in the wicked one”. Does the whole world there mean everybody? The words “world” and “all” are used in some seven or eight senses in Scripture, and it is very rarely the “all” means all persons, taken individually. The words are generally used to signify that Christ has redeemed some of all sorts — some Jews, some Gentiles, some rich, some poor, and has not restricted His redemption to either Jew or Gentile … C.H. Spurgeon from a sermon on Particular Redemption
As James White has pointed out “kings” make up a specific classification or collective of men. If indeed as White points out that “all” were to have been intended to mean each individual person than “all would be saved” and universalism would then become a biblical principle. Or if taken thusly as it is found in Titus 2:11 “For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men” than there would be no need to pray at all for “all” men would already know the Lord. Instead what is clearly meant is that God has not shut out any particular class of men from the possibility of salvation. He has not deemed “kings” for instance to be doomed hopeless but are rather a people also in need of prayer as all are. Here Paul merely perpetuates the same decrees expounded by Mark when he writes, “And He said to them, ‘Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation’”. The people are not meant only to share the gospel with a group distinguished by its birth right or gender but rather to the larger classification. The point is clear God is above making class distinctions with those of whom he chooses and as is stated here in Timothy wishes all classes of people to be prayed for… even violent “kings” such as Nero.
Alan Price says:
Just curious what your view of the concept of election is. I have become convinced that it has little to do with the Calvinistic interpretation you seem to be espousing, and more to do with creating a new Israel. In the Torah, the Histories and the Prophets, the concept of election spoke specifically of the nation of Israel as being God’s elected people. Considering that Paul, in all contested passages, was clearly calling to mind past ideas of election, shouldn’t that be our starting point in attempting to understand Paul’s language of election.
Furthermore, deconstructing the translated “all” is an interesting exercise, but doesn’t seem to override all the other passages in the Bible where clearly God speaks of caring for ALL people. The Ninevites (Jonah 4:10-11) come to mind.
I do find it easy to support a Calvinistic reading from a philosophical perspective. But from a thorough biblical reading it seems to be bending interpretation to the breaking point in attempting to create a thorough philosophical system.
May 23rd, 2007 at 5:13 am
Alan Price says:
Didn’t like my comment?
June 4th, 2007 at 12:27 pm
Ha Kohen says:
Comment is intelligent enough, I just didn’t receive it until now. The site is run by the editor and creator.
July 11th, 2007 at 11:14 am
Ha Kohen says:
The “Bride of Christ” illustration comes from Ephesians 5:25. and can be found elsewhere as well.
July 11th, 2007 at 11:19 am